clearly there are a good proportion of Americans who agree with us or those strongly against wouldn't feel so threatened.
Yeah! They're all in Congress and the White House!! ;)
Oh really? You think y'all will be letting him go? *rubs hands gleefully* We'll have to start a lobby for him to switch his residency to Texas and citizenship to the US!
We won't agree, of course...
Well, any debate that starts off with the premise that either system is an abject failure is destined to become embittered and go nowhere. Obviously, both, for instance, the US and the UK have fully functioning and good healthcare systems. Otherwise, people would literally be dying in our countries' respecitve streets, and neither of our systems and healthcare services would be envied, yes? So really this is a debate over which system is better, which is always going to be subjective; it's always going to come down to what we are willing to give up in exchange for the assurance of something else. (Though I still contend there's no reason that having a free market health care system and having health care access for all must be mutually exclusive.) But this being the case, I have a question for you, rhetorical if you want: Why does the UK need private insurance if it has the NHS? In other words, why give private industry, which you suggested can't be trusted, any place in your market when the government can do it better? Sincerely, I don't understand why so much emphasis is spent on the "irreversable ills" (shortly put) of privatized healthcare systems only for the promise to be brought up that it still does/will exist. (But truly, it won't in the US if the House Bill is passed. We will go further than y'all - it won't exist. It will be outlawed.)
While intense and distinctly uncomfortable at times, I'd have to say that at least from my experience, this wasn't a hostile debate. -And I mean that as a compliment to you, especially since it became you vs 2.- I've been in far, far, far worse situations (of my own contributions to bring it there), and Terri... Well, I don't call her "Mini-Coulter" lightly... even if she hates it. lol So we both appreciate - but me especially - you keeping it to the issues exempting the word-twisting game tangent. You challenged me to examine and then word my beliefs, if not always articulately, which is the best kind of debate there is. - Especially if we can walk away as friends. :) We all need to be taken out of our comfort zones at times, and I'd much prefer it to be with a buddy.
I don't think you believe we're bad people or ignorant or hateful or anything else. In fact, I'm pretty well confident enough to say I know you don't. The point was that my opinions of events are not based in "dislike" or "hate." I know you're not an American, so you might not know, but that is what everyone in Washington, the media, and a very large portion of the American Left accuses us of every time we say a word against the President. We're called haters, racists, mobs, violent, assassins, nazis, too stupid, fearmongers... the list goes on and on. Anything to discredit our opinions to be based off some irrational reaction rather than a valid difference of opinion. So when you began suggesting, even in the slightest, the ignorance and hysterics and dislike, you were pretty much stepping on a landmine. Thus the reason I reacted the way I did, because I am completely exhausted of it. And that's not your fault, so I'm sorry you unkowningly walked into that after I'd decided not to let it go anymore. I made the decision because that's never been the person I am; I very carefully consider all my positions before speaking on them. It probably would have been better of me to explain that to you in the first place...
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Date: 2009-10-12 01:07 am (UTC)Yeah! They're all in Congress and the White House!! ;)
Oh really? You think y'all will be letting him go? *rubs hands gleefully* We'll have to start a lobby for him to switch his residency to Texas and citizenship to the US!
We won't agree, of course...
Well, any debate that starts off with the premise that either system is an abject failure is destined to become embittered and go nowhere. Obviously, both, for instance, the US and the UK have fully functioning and good healthcare systems. Otherwise, people would literally be dying in our countries' respecitve streets, and neither of our systems and healthcare services would be envied, yes? So really this is a debate over which system is better, which is always going to be subjective; it's always going to come down to what we are willing to give up in exchange for the assurance of something else. (Though I still contend there's no reason that having a free market health care system and having health care access for all must be mutually exclusive.) But this being the case, I have a question for you, rhetorical if you want: Why does the UK need private insurance if it has the NHS? In other words, why give private industry, which you suggested can't be trusted, any place in your market when the government can do it better? Sincerely, I don't understand why so much emphasis is spent on the "irreversable ills" (shortly put) of privatized healthcare systems only for the promise to be brought up that it still does/will exist. (But truly, it won't in the US if the House Bill is passed. We will go further than y'all - it won't exist. It will be outlawed.)
While intense and distinctly uncomfortable at times, I'd have to say that at least from my experience, this wasn't a hostile debate. -And I mean that as a compliment to you, especially since it became you vs 2.- I've been in far, far, far worse situations (of my own contributions to bring it there), and Terri... Well, I don't call her "Mini-Coulter" lightly... even if she hates it. lol So we both appreciate - but me especially - you keeping it to the issues exempting the word-twisting game tangent. You challenged me to examine and then word my beliefs, if not always articulately, which is the best kind of debate there is. - Especially if we can walk away as friends. :) We all need to be taken out of our comfort zones at times, and I'd much prefer it to be with a buddy.
I don't think you believe we're bad people or ignorant or hateful or anything else. In fact, I'm pretty well confident enough to say I know you don't. The point was that my opinions of events are not based in "dislike" or "hate." I know you're not an American, so you might not know, but that is what everyone in Washington, the media, and a very large portion of the American Left accuses us of every time we say a word against the President. We're called haters, racists, mobs, violent, assassins, nazis, too stupid, fearmongers... the list goes on and on. Anything to discredit our opinions to be based off some irrational reaction rather than a valid difference of opinion. So when you began suggesting, even in the slightest, the ignorance and hysterics and dislike, you were pretty much stepping on a landmine. Thus the reason I reacted the way I did, because I am completely exhausted of it. And that's not your fault, so I'm sorry you unkowningly walked into that after I'd decided not to let it go anymore. I made the decision because that's never been the person I am; I very carefully consider all my positions before speaking on them. It probably would have been better of me to explain that to you in the first place...